A wave of nostalgia swept across social media recently when Pooja Bhatt shared the poster of her 1993 film Pehla Nasha. The post not only revived memories of the cult thriller but also transported many back to a phase when several now-established names were still finding their place in the industry.

For Deepak Tijori, the film remains especially close to his heart. While speaking to us, the actor admitted that Pooja’s gesture caught him by surprise and stirred a flood of emotions.

“I was surprised to see the post. But I can expect that out of Pooja; she has always been that kind of person. She has always been there for me, and seeing her put up that poster just brought back so many memories from that phase of my life,” he says warmly.

Back in the early ’90s, Deepak was still navigating his way through the industry. He recalls, “In 1993, I was still getting there as an actor. I had been doing supporting roles, and this was a big moment for me. What made it even more special was that Pooja, who was already a star at that time, immediately said yes to the film. Even with Raveena Tandon, there was no hesitation; she came on board with complete conviction. That kind of support meant a lot to me back then.”

The film also marked the directorial debut of Ashutosh Gowariker, making the experience even more memorable for the team. Deepak remembers the atmosphere on set as one filled with youthful energy and genuine camaraderie.

“This was Ashutosh’s first film, my first as a lead — it was a very sentimental journey for all of us. Honestly, we were having a blast more than we were shooting a film. There was so much energy, so much enthusiasm. It remains one of those rare experiences in my life that I will always cherish,” he shares.

One of the film’s most talked-about sequences featured an impressive line-up of stars, including Shah Rukh Khan, Aamir Khan, Rahul Roy and Sudesh Berry. “Even that sequence was a treat. To have all these actors come together — it added a certain charm to the film. It felt like everyone was rooting for us,” he says.

Despite the passion and promise behind the project, Pehla Nasha struggled at the box office. According to Deepak, external circumstances heavily impacted the film’s release.

“At the time of release, the film ran into complications with distribution. Around the same time, the 1993 blasts had happened, so naturally people were not going to theatres the way they normally would. The film didn’t get the kind of release it deserved, and it wasn’t a box office success. But for us, it was never just about numbers — it was a very emotional project,” he explains.

From Bombay Begums and Big Girls Don't Cry to Bigg Boss OTT 2, Pooja Bhatt has made her way in the digital entertainment space. The actress, a prominent name in the 1990s who later transitioned to filmmaking and took a long hiatus from acting, made her comeback through OTT platforms. But she insists she’s no newcomer to this medium — after all, Doordarshan was her version of OTT back in the ’90s!

For Pooja, streaming might be the current trend, but she appeared in living rooms long before it became a phenomenon. She explains, “My birth came from OTT when I was 17. I was in a film called Daddy, produced by DD, and it was released on TV. So, Doordarshan was the OTT of those days. This medium is not new to me. These platforms are modern OTT.”

Pooja, who hosted the podcast The Pooja Bhatt Show last year, hopes that shows like these offer young actors a reality check. “Someone needs to tell them that showbiz is not only a glitzy road full of highs. You are signing up for a lifetime of uncertainty and doors being slammed in your face. It’s a journey where you will be second-guessing yourself and asking, ‘Am I really good?’ These are things they don’t teach you enough in film schools. They won’t talk about failure, loss or how to deal with replacements.”

Following her divorce in 2014, Pooja has embraced singlehood and lives life on her own terms. “It is glorious. I am enjoying being single. I have been in relationships probably since I was 16. I am as free as a bird now. I am the captain of my own ship. I call my own shots. I have so much love to offer to the world. I have friends, cats, books and my craft. I am a nomad and I travel a lot. I want to be able to pick up my bag and go whenever I want. I discovered gymming at the age of 50. For me, my gym is my temple now.”

Sharing her thoughts on marriage and love, she continues, “I will always be someone who will celebrate love. I have a combination of friends - some who have been married for 40 years and some who have been divorced four times. I am not missing out on anything. For the first time in my life, I feel complete. I think it has taken me a long time to realize that it is not only about finding the right person, but about being the right person. I quit alcohol eight and a half years ago. Quitting alcohol was the easy part, but when you do that, you realize what you were running away from while that drink was being used as a painkiller. Love is no different.”

“I don’t think my romantic films fit into the quintessential romantic mould,” says Mohit Suri, distancing himself from the song-and-dance template often associated with Hindi love stories. “Some of my biggest songs, like Tum Hi Ho, aren’t lip-synced. I don’t have dance numbers either. I don’t know where I fit in – it’s just my way of expressing love.”

Yet films like Saiyyara (2025), which left youngsters teary-eyed in cinemas last year, have revived the mainstream appetite for intense love stories. During his recent visit to Delhi, where he received the All India Management Association (AIMA) award for Director of the Year, he decoded love stories in a chat with us.

​Ask what he felt as a director when he saw reels coming in showing youngsters crying after watching Saiyyara, and he shares, “I’ve never been able to analyse it. I don’t know what I have or what I did that made people cry.”

After a pause, he reflects, “But I remember Pooja Bhatt telling me this very early in my career – that if anyone has been able to touch my heart, other than my father, in the films he makes, it’s you. You’ve that in you, and it’s very rare. Mahesh Bhatt also told me that.”

He elaborates, “I never went out to shoot a scene thinking, ‘In this scene, I will make you cry.’ I’ve never been able to do that. And I am not that kind of filmmaker who knows how the audience is going to react.”

​A clip went viral from a round-table discussion when everyone was talking about when they last watched a film in a cinema hall, and he turned around to his fellows and asked, “Don’t you guys go to the theatre?”

He says it was more of a surprise to him, adding, “My TV is huge. I have about a 100-inch TV at home. It’s a great experience. I’ve got great sound. Even in my office, I have a theatre, but it’s still not the theatre, because I don’t have 100 more people watching the film with me together. Humans like to watch entertainment in groups.”

He explains, “Look at cricket. Why do stadiums still get filled? Maybe not so much for a Test match, but for T20. So theatres will still get full. It’s just that the game is no longer a Test match – it’s more like T20. So the kind of content we put in theatres has to change. We can complain that people are not going to theatres, or we can get up and do something about it.”

​Are there any particular elements for a good love story? Suri explains, “In a basic love story, I think what essentially has to work is – it’s not about what’s on the page. It’s about what magic you bring about on the set. Because a love story is very simple on the page. They don’t have the thrill of lots of twists and turns or action. So it’s like — there is nothing on the page; it’s just written: he looks at her. But the way he looks at her — that is the magic.”

Citing a scene from Saiyaara, Mohit says, “Nobody reacted when I told them she takes Mahesh’s name. They were just like, ‘Oh, that’s sad.’ But the way they reacted in the theatres – people burst out crying. More than that, moviegoers cried in the last scene when they got married. And that’s a happy scene. Why were they crying there? It is because they felt validated that this girl who had left had come back. So I think that’s the magic you create on the set.” Suri believes that for love stories, “we just have to live the emotion.”

He elaborates, “That’s the only thing. You have to live with the actors; they’re living with the characters. In thrillers, you can cheat – you can use a different camera angle but in love stories, you have to bring out an emotion.”

Actor Mukul Dev passed away on May 23. He was in the ICU for a week and was battling health issues. Mugdha Godse expressed, "Shocked and saddened. He was a great actor and a friend."

Mukul made a striking Bollywood debut in 1996 with Mahesh Bhatt’s Dastak, a thriller that also launched Sushmita Sen and Sharad Kapoor. In a conversation with Bombay Times, the renowned director recalled his impression of Mukul and what made him special in a film that launched three newcomers.

Shocked by the news, Bhatt said, “Vikram Bhatt called me up this morning and said, Bhatt saab, I have heard the news and I'm so frightened to even confirm this news. Vikram was my associate in Dastak so most of the action scenes and most of the work was done by him with all these three actors, you know. He had a deep bond with him. So, he called me and asked me to verify and then I called Pooja, she was close to Mukul and Pooja herself was astounded. And then we started to inquire from here, there, everywhere until it came through some source on Instagram that he had passed away. So, then I did confirm that to Pooja who was quite devastated, even to Vikram. Mukul was a very close member of our tribe which kind of journeyed through time, you know.”

Remembering Mukul, the director said, “What flickers on the screen of my mind is Mukul’s radiant smile. The most heart-warming smile that would be not only on his lips but in his entire gait, from his eyes, lips, eyes, his entire body would smile when he smiled. He was not aggressive in his demeanour. He was shy, not very outgoing. I don't mean he was shy that he would step back but he was always within the boundaries of his own given space. He would very respectfully carry himself within that. One thing that I noticed very early about him was he was very generous because all three of them were newcomers in the film. You always felt his warmth; never felt his obtrusive presence. There was no attempt of his to flash like a neon sign trying to make his presence felt.”

How did he discover the actor, we ask. “People would come to me because they knew that I was always looking for new people. I would cast new faces in movies. So, I think like Anupam Kher and Rahul Roy, Mukul too came to me looking for an opening in the movies. That’s how Dastak happened. The film was around Sushmita. She came with the dazzle of being Miss Universe. Obviously, tinseltown looks for faces which are radiant and have run up to the glamour world. She came with her thunder, but she was not the kind of person who would flaunt it. She had the humility to own up that she was a beginner. Like all of them. All three were equally confident. I thought Mukul had the charm and I just thought that he fitted that role, he had the language. He was a person who was quite distinct from the raw look of Sharad Kapoor. I needed someone who looked the opposite of Sharad Kapoor so I cast Mukul. He was refined and well-groomed and kind of cultured. Not somebody who like Sharad, had the dust of life on him.”

The director says he heard of Mukul through common friends over the years but drifted apart. “The harsh truth about our business is that when we work, we work on intense projects and we are so intensely engaged with each other. And that's the glue, right? And then when the movie gets over, irrespective of what the outcome of the film is, if you don't work together, you do drift apart. Because you're all fiercely engaged in your own activity of life. Especially if you happen to drift away and go to another town. I used to keep on meeting his brother, Rahul. Very charming man. I used to keep on inquiring about him. I heard he was in Delhi, looking after his ailing mother. He lost her and grief can take a toll. He was ailing himself. Loneliness is a very difficult space to deal with, especially when you have been in the arc lights. And then to be in Delhi and away from the so-called razzle and dazzle of Mumbai. This is based on what I heard but losing an ailing parent can erode you.”

On a concluding note, Bhatt said, “Mukul did leave in his own way his footprints on the sands of time. I remember him as a very warm, endearing man. Mukul Dev still smiles in my head. A radiant smile that lights up my heart.”

Actor Ranvir Shorey dated actor Pooja Bhatt in the early 2000s. However, their relationship ended on a bad note, with Pooja accusing him of being “physically violent” towards her. In a recent chat, Ranvir opened up about the break-up and how Pooja’s brother, Rahul Bhatt, and father, filmmaker Mahesh Bhatt, were also involved in that ugly phase of their lives.

“At the time we had a conflict, I felt that the respect I had for him (Mahesh), he used that manipulatively. When the fight happened, he told my father, ‘Okay, we will rest the matter here.’ Next day, he got utter lies printed about me, planted false stories in the media and painted me as an alcoholic, abusive person. All lies,” the actor told YouTuber Siddharth Kanan.

Ranvir added, “Pooja’s brother was the one who assaulted me. He (Mahesh) could have told these guys not to talk like that.”

Ranvir married actor Konkona Sen Sharma in 2010, but they separated after five years of marriage. They have a son, Haroon Shorey, 13, in shared custody.

Considering the fact that web releases are consumed by cinewatchers at a time that’s most convenient to them, the OTT boom has eased the stress related to a ‘Friday box-office performance’. But the day of his film’s release is still a euphoric one for Mahesh Bhatt, who has spent decades keeping tabs on the opening numbers of his movies. Bhatt’s Disney+ Hotstar production Bloody Ishq, which aired on the platform on Friday, opened to mixed reviews. What makes the offering particularly special, however, is that it marks a prominent commercial release for actor Avika Gor, who acquired immense fame as a child actor for her role in the teleshow, Balika Vadhu.

The casting, though unusual, is not a surprising move, given the fact that Bhatt has consistently invested in actors instead of ‘stars’. “[Late producer] Rajkumar Barjatya told me something vital during [the filming of] Saaransh [1984]. I was in search of a producer for the film. Sanjeev Kumar was a dear friend. People had assumed that Sanjeev would lead the film while Anupam [Kher] would be the second lead. But Anupam insisted that he lead it. He [spoke with] passion, and I agreed. When Sanjeev saw the film, he admitted that he wouldn’t have been able to do what Anupam did. Mr Barjatya told me, ‘You pick the actor you believe in, kyunki, ultimately, chalti toh picture hi hai’. Today, Anupam has done 500 movies, and Saaransh was a defining one for him. Since the release of Raaz, we have predominantly worked with new people. When the hoopla passes, the movie stays with you,” says Bhatt, lamenting that today, producers choose to invest in stars to make a project “safe”.

Calling the new breed of movie-makers “risk averse”, he says, “Moneybags know that star power makes a project safe. But, I don’t want to rely on the star to do well. I want our story to hold people’s attention.”

Easily among the names who’ve contributed to creating the identity of horror films in Indian cinema, Bhatt believes the decision to determine if the genre has evolved significantly over the years rests with the audience.

“We achieved a breakthrough with Raaz. Horror, until then, was seen with disdain. By stitching good music and keeping human relationships at the narrative’s core, we made a spectacular film. And while we made several franchises in the genre, I don’t think [today’s filmmakers] have been able to break new ground as storytellers. Filmmakers of yesteryear had a gambler’s spirit. Now, executives decide when to greenlight films. Storytelling today is not as path-breaking as it was a decade ago.”

He points to his daughter Pooja Bhatt’s film, Jism (2003), to further his case. “No one thought that a leading lady would promote the idea that ‘the body knows no love, just lust’. To make edgy, neurotic films, you need a free pass.”

Even though production houses have become commercially aware in the aftermath of the setbacks they faced during the pandemic, several artistes have faced challenges due to the industry’s changing norms. “It is difficult to make content these days. Even in Hollywood, people who have been in the industry for years are seeking alternate jobs. The industry is in shambles. The traditional way of movie-making is getting outdated.”

When Pooja Bhatt returned to acting with Bombay Begums (2021) after a gap of 21 years, was she surprised by the diversity of roles being written? Absolutely. It has been a pleasant ride since then as the actor has carefully chosen her parts, picking only those that speak to her, most recently that of a principal in Big Girls Don’t Cry. Now, Bhatt has given her nod to a yet-untitled web series that sees her alongside Suniel Shetty.

mid-day got its hands on an image that shows Bhatt’s look in the Lionsgate offering. For the actor, it was the character’s “sheer power” that drew her to the role.

“I have always had the privilege and made the choice to portray empowered women on screen. I was immediately drawn to this character for the sheer power, depth and empathy she exudes. Her ability to take a stand for what she believes in and face challenges head-on is something I connect with on a personal level,” she shares.

While details of her role are being kept under wraps, her co-star Shetty recently posted an image of himself on a snow-capped mountain, announcing that the show has taken him back to the action genre. 

Pooja Bhatt’s return to acting after 21 years came on her own terms, with the web series Bombay Begums in 2021. And for that, the actor-director — recently seen in the web show Big Girls Don't Cry — says she has the medium to thank.

In a lot of ways, Pooja’s beginnings on OTT remind her of her first brush with acting 27 years ago. “My launch was through Daddy (1997), which my father (filmmaker Mahesh Bhatt) decided to release on Doordarshan. He was advised against it because TV was a bad word back then,” she recalls, adding, “But when it released, Daddy took me into people’s hearts and homes overnight because of its relevant theme. It proved the medium is not important, the story is. And that is what OTT also proves.”

Pooja — whose recent film Sanaa is doing the rounds of film festivals — made her digital debut with the layered character of Rani in Bombay Begums. Following this, she explored the non-fictional side of the space with the reality show, Bigg Boss OTT. Her most recent appearance, as the principal in Big Girls Don’t Cry, gave her another chance to portray a complex character.

Such diversity, she feels, can also be credited to OTT. The 52-year-old shares, “With the influx of streaming platforms, there are more roles for actors of different age groups, body types and backgrounds. Back in the day when I entered [showbiz], it was all about a hero, heroine, villain and hero’s friend. Those lines have blurred completely, which is wonderful.”

Giving her own example, she narrates, “I came back after 21 years and I got a character like Rani, which is close to my age. She is a woman who is dealing with menopause, marriage issues and love. She isn’t coloured with one brush.”

While she’s all praise for the freedom and opportunity that OTT provides, Pooja fears that star culture is taking over the space. “Many decision-makers are going back to old methods of casting [big] names before looking at the story. There are some backward-thinking people who ask, ‘Yeh kahani toh kaamal hai magar star kaun hai?’ And I am like, ‘Star se kya hota hai?’ You can make a star; that is the magic of OTT,” says the actor, whose next is also a web release.

As Pooja Bhatt enjoys a new inning in her career with diverse roles, the actor continues to field relentless questions about her relationship status.

“I’m often asked, ‘Why are you not married? Why are you single? You’re doing so well for yourself. You’re an attractive woman.’ And I tell them, ‘Boss, I don’t need to be rescued’,” she shares.

Recently seen in the web series Big Girls Don't Cry, the 52-year-old elaborates, “If I need somebody, that person would be a companion. I’m not looking for a solution. A man can’t be a solution to a woman. We have to be able to walk our own path.”

Bhatt’s personal life has always been in the public eye, from her marriage to ex-husband, VJ Manish Makhija to her relationship with actor Ranvir Shorey. Currently single, the Bombay Begums (2021) and Sanaa (2022) actor isn’t focused on her personal life.

“If I find a companion, that would be the greatest gift. If I don’t, that’s okay. I am grateful for my life. I have my family, my dad and my work. I got great wealth through my friendships. I am not incomplete because I am single,” she asserts, revealing that she has had several people try to take on the duty of matchmaker for her.

“Some people come up to me and say, ‘Shaadi kar lo’, but kyun kar loon? They want to introduce me to someone. I’m not looking for a matchmaker. If the universe wants me to meet somebody, it will happen,” she says.

It’s joyful to play a principal who encourages her students’ individuality. The feeling is further heightened when you’ve been a rebellious youngster in your growing-up years. Which is why Big Girls Don't Cry, set in an all-girls’ boarding school, was an easy yes for Pooja Bhatt.

“I went to a wonderful school in Mumbai that focused on character [building]. But I was also the kid who’d bid goodbye to her cousins going to boarding school. So, I felt deprived of that experience. When Sudhanshu Saria [co-director], with whom I’ve done Sanaa, called me for Big Girls Don’t Cry, it was a tick for me. The big tick was my role. I have been thrown off sometimes for speaking my mind and being a rebellious young star in Bollywood. [In my early years in the industry], we were told that if we wanted to make it big, we needed to keep our opinions to ourselves. So, I thought, ‘Wow! I get to be a principal [who can teach the girls otherwise],’” she begins.

To share screen space with seven newcomers—Avantika Vandanapu, Dalai, Akshita Sood, Lhakyila, Afrah Sayed, Aneet Padda and Vidushi—filled Bhatt with several emotions. The actor felt protective of them, and in awe of their unaffected nature.

She says, “I had a responsibility to make them feel secure because when I did my first film at 17, the senior actors would stay back to give me cues. These are things we carry forward. These girls aren’t tarnished by the baggage and bullshit of Bollywood, which will tell them, ‘Now, we can [groom you] to get you [more films].’ I hope they have the capacity to turn around and kick them hard where it hurts.” 

Through the Prime Video series, creator Nitya Mehra has given showbiz new actors filled with potential. Bhatt highlights that for all the debate on nepotism, this is a chance for people to put their opinions to action.

“I am sick and tired of this ridiculous conversation about people not getting their due in the entertainment business. We’ve launched many new girls, they represent the future. Now, the world can decide whether they want to put their money where their mouth is and give these girls their rightful due, or they want to sit behind their computer screens and keep talking about nepotism. [Some of those crying foul] don’t have the capacity to admit that maybe they didn’t have it, that’s why they didn’t make it [in films].”

On Tuesday, Pooja Bhatt became the proud owner of a new car, one that she jokes is much like her—“intense and evolved.” There’s more to her bright green Mini Cooper than just style. With the all-electric car, Bhatt has made the environmentally conscious choice of joining the electric vehicle (EV) revolution.

“A lot of people dissuaded me from getting an electric vehicle, saying that one should wait for a couple more years before it becomes a norm. But I went ahead because electric vehicles contribute to a greener future by producing zero emissions. They are easier to maintain than petrol vehicles, and the small size ensures I navigate the traffic snarls in Mumbai,” says the actor-producer.

The primary factor for the shift, she admits, was the severe air pollution in the country, with the air quality index (AQI) in Mumbai and Delhi reaching an alarming high. At such a time, electric vehicles are a smart choice over petrol- and diesel-guzzling vehicles that further contribute to the pollution. Bhatt believes it is up to each of us to conserve the planet.

“When it comes to combating the ill-effects of climate change, it’s important to not only walk one’s talk, but also drive one’s talk. I found it absurd to spend an obscene amount of money on a fuel-guzzling SUV. So, I went for a car, which is small in size, but big in terms of its contribution to maintaining [a healthy] AQI.”

The actor-producer, who took her new set of wheels for a two-day trip, is thoroughly enjoying the new ride. “I hope I have a seamless experience with my EV, and never go back to driving a petrol or diesel car again.”

Bollywood actress Udita Goswami, who was seen in films like Paap, Aksar and Zeher, is now back in action; however, not on screen. She’s now a full-time deejay, and in a chat with us, she reveals how she was never happy facing the camera and has found her true calling. Udita says, “Love for music runs in the family. My brother works in the corporate world, but if you give him a guitar, he can become the life of a party. From a very young age, I enjoyed music, and it made me happy.”

Udita says, “I am quite sure that if I wasn’t an actress, I would have become a musician. I had forayed into music in 2012, and then I got married (to filmmaker Mohit Suri) in 2013. I was the deejay at one of my wedding parties, and my friend DJ Suketu, taught me more about music. I never did a course in acting, but I went through a course in music production!”

She shares, “In those days, many models were becoming actors. I was also modelling in Delhi when Pooja (Bhatt), who was looking for an actress in Paap, came to Delhi and offered me the film. Everything fell into place, and I became an actress. Acting is serious business, you need to be talented to act, and I felt that I was not cut out for it. Acting is not about looking good.”

Her passion for full-fledged deejaying took off after her kids were born. She says, “I decided to resume after my daughter Devi turned four, but in 2017, my son was born, and then again, I took a break for two years. Then the pandemic happened. Post that, I did a three-month intensive course in music and deejaying, and now I am doing one gig in a week. I have learnt it the hard way. It is now easier for me. I just go with the energy of the crowd about the choice of songs.”

Udita adds, “I don’t want to go for private parties, I want to play for college festivals, clubs and make it memorable for everyone. I often have this discussion with Mohit and say, ‘I wonder why I ever thought of becoming an actor?’ But he tells me that being an actor has somehow led me to this.”

There are not many female deejays in the country, and Udita shares how it is not easy because of safety reasons. “There are times when people get drunk. When that happens, I don’t oblige them with any pictures and make sure that my bouncers are around,” she says. But Udita feels people haven’t fully accepted her as a DJ.

She says, “It has been tough to get acceptance as a DJ. I am still facing resistance from people. I laugh out loud and tell those people to come to my gigs and see for themselves. I have practised in eateries post lunchtime when they were shut, or early in the mornings. I have worked hard at it.”

Sunny Leone. There, now that I have your attention, with the world’s most googled name, over multiple years—it might be easier to have you explore Karenjit Kaur Vohra, the actual person behind the screen name.

To start with, why is she Sunny Leone, of all names. I wondered about this, dozing off, watching a show recently, where they mentioned the African country, Sierra Leone in it, and I read the subtitles as Sunny Leone!

Wait, is she named after the African country? The real story, and I couldn’t find it detailed on Google, is equally random. When she was still Karenjit—meaning, not yet entered the adult film industry (the accepted euphemism for porn)—she was being interviewed, I’m assuming, for a girlie magazine, after debuting as a pin-up.

Sunny recalls, “So, I was at work. This was at a tax retirement firm, where I did all kinds of jobs, one of which was as the receptionist. During that call, that I had to finish fast, they asked me what should they name me? I couldn’t think of anything, so I said Sunny, which is my brother’s name. He is Sandeep Singh. For the last name, I asked them to pick one themselves.”

As it turns out, the magazine’s owner was Italian. Hence, Leone. Aha, got it—as in filmmaker Sergio Leone (popular Italian surname), not Sierra Leone! That said, Sunny Leone, which Karenjit sees totally as a brand, distinct from her, has gone through multiple makeovers itself. Besides the influencer behind several businesses, from cosmetics to crypto, Sunny Leone 2.0 is a Bollywood actor.

We take this for granted, of course. But, is there any other person from the adult film industry in the world, who’s made that critical transition into mainstream showbiz, in the first place? “In India, for sure, not. In the world? I don’t know! There is Paris Hilton, Kim Kardashian, Tommy Lee… Okay, they’re entertainers, not [mainstream] actors,” Sunny agrees.

And this breaking of a global taboo happened in India, of all places. She’d obviously been to India—where her Punjabi parents first moved to Canada from—quite a few times, growing up: “But as Karen, not Sunny Leone!”

When she got an offer from India to enter the reality show, Bigg Boss, in 2011, she first refused—wary of how the desi public will respond to her, besides understandable safety concerns.

The guys at Colors TV, evidently, made her an offer she couldn’t refuse. The money was good enough for her “down-payment for house” in LA. She had just got married to Daniel Weber, also her business partner. It was just two weeks’ work, and back home. That was the plan. The channel had also assured her that security would not be an issue.

Landing in Mumbai, she and her bodyguard from LA, decided to take a quick peek into what was going on outside the airport, while Weber went off to fetch the bags. And, phew, she saw a massive, uncontrollable crowd, jostling outside, to catch a glimpse of ‘Sunny Leone’: “We just rushed back. The military at the airport had to form a human chain, as we were somehow finally escorted out.”

That frenzy continues, clearly. Consider an image from Kerala that went viral online once, when Sunny had visited Kochi to promote a cellphone brand: “We’ve done such events, a million times. But with this one, the stage was small. From the car, I could see lots of people outside.

“Once I got out, there was a swarm, for as long as you could see, hanging from buses... It takes your breath away! People were analyzing later online, that they were from a political rally, nearby. But they were all yelling my name! It’s on my way back that I saw that picture you’re talking about: ‘Holy shit!’

“They were well-behaved, though, and the police were on guard. Security concerns depend on circumstances. Sometimes you’re at greater risk at a lounge or a nightclub than in a public place.”

What this insane love for Sunny reveals about us—an inherent non-judgmental liberalism, or sheer hypocrisy, is hard to tell.  What’s common, regardless of where you’re in India, as she’s mentioned before, is Sunny being stared at.

“I think it’s an Indian thing. It’s not just with me. They just stare straight at you. I just walk with my horse blinders on. The funniest is, when I actually say hello to someone, on a set, or in general—they just slink away. They don’t say a hey, back. That’s even ruder!”

Ever since the Bigg Boss gig, Sunny says her life has been on a “wheel turning on its own”. Bigg Boss led to Pooja Bhatt’s Jism 2, her Bollywood debut, that was a hit, chiefly for its top-class soundtrack.

The film-offer happened with filmmaker Mahesh Bhatt entering the Bigg Boss house to publicly sign her up. She thought it was a gimmick/joke: “I didn’t know who he was. Recently, I was on the set with Pooja [Bhatt] getting into the Bigg Boss house. How life comes a full circle!”

On her maiden Bollywood shoot, she felt like a “fish out of water”. Otherwise, her knowledge of Hindi cinema was limited to VHS tapes of films her family played—on occasion, for late-night pyjama plus pizza parties at home.

It’s not that she thought about those films much, let alone imagine starring in them: “I could understand the movies, because Punjabi is similar to Hindi. Being from a conservative family, I spoke to my mother about how the heroines in those films were allowed to wear certain clothes, that I wasn’t permitted to at home. Those were my concerns!”

This tallies with the usual desi Diaspora life, doesn’t it? “It does. And I have a theory. Don’t know about now, but back then, the home-sick migrants, who moved to other countries, chose to create a ‘time warp’ around themselves—for when, and what they had left behind. So, inside their homes, they recreated the same philosophies of Indian life and culture [to feel like they hadn’t moved at all].” Sounds like Dilwale Dulhania Le Jayenge (1995), surely.

That was young Karen’s life. Before she became ‘Sunny Leone’, the adult film star, and thereafter a Bollywood actor, of course. There is a scene in Jism 2, where she heaves and moans, to tell her co-actor on screen, “You think this is easy. It looks like it. It’s not.”

While she didn’t write that line, she believes in it: “No matter what you do, if you’re an entertainer, it’s true, it’s a tough life. Even if you have families backing you—they can’t help you win the love of the public.

“And when you’re working, nobody asks you what your day was like, or what you’re going through, on that day—you just perform. Even if someone did ask—you wouldn’t say how you feel. You wear a mask, all the time.”

Take her journey to be taken seriously as a mainstream actor, for instance. She says she did go through acting workshops, before the shoot of Jism 2. And she’s had a team of coaches since.

At one point, she was paying an acting instructor, $200-$300 an hour—“they can be that expensive.” This is because a top Mumbai filmmaker had asked her to audition for the lead in a major production.

And, apparently, she declined—because she was offered economy-class tickets to arrive at the shoot? “Oh, no, that was still okay… It was everything across the board. And I am not talking about some small-budget film, or a production company that couldn’t afford things to be put into the budget for an artiste. It just seemed so unreasonable. But, hey, I did pass the audition!”

She doesn’t name the film. I’m thinking (in my head), Vishal Bhardwaj’s Rangoon (2017), where she could potentially crack the whip well, as Hunterwali, or the Australian-Indian Fearless Nadia. But why hazard a guess.

“Let’s just say, the gentleman’s films did very well, but this one, I auditioned for, went average. So, everything happens for a reason.” Sunny did bag and see through the lead part of Charlie in Anurag Kashyap’s Kennedy, post an audition, that was “held before the entire office, with everyone being asked how it went!” 

She was terrified. Only to realize—when she hung out with these audience members, over a drink, much later—that she had been pre-selected, already: “Anurag sir probably just wanted to check if I’ll show up [for the audition]. Of course, I will. Since things have landed on my shoulders on their own, I may have created the impression that I won’t test for parts, which is obviously not true.”

This is the first time I’ve met Sunny. Strangely, one thing that most journalists say, once they do interview her, is how surprised they were to find her so sorted in the head. As if adult films stars posing, consensually, before a camera, must be ditzy brunettes.

If anything, you expect candour from a rare celebrity in this part of the world, who’s owned her life so publicly, through a documentary, Mostly Sunny (2016)—even a multi-season, semi-fictional series on her life, Karenjit Kaur - The Untold Story Of Sunny Leone (2018). Which, I’ve to admit, I couldn’t finish, because the crappy app it’s on (ZEE5) just wouldn’t allow me to! 

“What’s in the series, is all true. I was clear about that, when they approached me for it. I’m very emotional about my family, and I wouldn’t have it any other way,” Sunny promises.

That series starts with an interview by a journalist, trying to slut-shame Sunny, to state it crudely. It’s somewhat based on news anchor Bhupendra Chaubey’s chat with her for News 18 in 2016. Which showed a really unfazed and warm side of Sunny—she says stuff like, it’s possible that superstar Aamir Khan may not wish to work with someone like her, but that’s okay.

Soon after, she got a call from Aamir, Sunny recalls, “He felt the same cringe. So many others too called up, to say they were proud of me: Anil Kapoor, Sonam Kapoor, Hrithik Roshan…”

Given the context, on a lark, I asked ChatGTP what Chaubey’s former colleague, broadcaster Rajdeep Sardesai, might ask Sunny Leone in an interview. All crappy questions. Our jobs are still safe. But I ask her one from that list, anyway.

‘You’ve faced a lot of criticism and backlash from some sections of society for your past work, how do you deal with such negativity?’ Sunny says, “I don’t deal. These people leaving comments are still there, only moving me up in Google rankings.” So, who’s the loser here—fair call/point!

The other thing interesting about the Karenjit Kaur series is it features a stand-up comedian called Rusty, who is so obviously based on the Canadian, desi comic, Russell Peters. Rusty makes jokes on Sunny part of his stand-up routine, while they had actually once dated. True story?

“Yeah, you should check it out. Not that I mind at all. It’s for the laughs, it’s totally fine.” How long had they dated? “For a hot second! We were great together, as friends—drinking, being silly, funny… We went on a date, and just messed it up. I’d still be so happy to meet him.”

As per that series, again, her boyfriend then (Daniel), husband now, beats the shit out of Rusty for using Sunny in his gags: “Oh, no that was just sensationalizing. That never happened. All that family parts in the series, though, are all true. 

“Actually, when I met Danny is when I was still just dating Russell. Once Danny and I got together, I just had to drop my friendship with Russell. It’d be a mixing of weirdness, otherwise. Felt sad about it.”

Unsure if Sunny continues to make it to Russell’s stand-up set. Surely, it’d be better than other Sunny jokes floating around, forever: ‘What happens when Sunny Deol marries Sunny Leone? They both become Sunny Leone!’ She doesn’t find any of them funny, anyway: “Danny does; but he has a different sense of humour!”

Having spent over a decade in Mumbai—which, even for Indians is a tough city to live in—Sunny says it’s her pucca New Yorker, Brooklyn, Jewish husband, Daniel, who’s turned more desi, as a result.

She laughs, “Well, don’t go by my American accent. I’m totally Indian myself too. And even after I retire, Mumbai will remain my home forever. But when I see Danny order chicken tikka all the time, bob his head, say, ‘time-pass’, ‘just’, ‘only’… I’m like, ‘Who are you, dude?’”

The only thing that surprises me about Sunny is that she’s a Trump supporter, or at least a sufficient sympathizer—and this, only because she’s the daughter of Indian migrants herself. Trump’s views on migration, in general, are well-known.

Besides that it’s not proven (or proven otherwise) that Trump was a sexual offender at all, or that his supporters stormed the Capitol, when he lost the elections—Sunny’s arguments are focused more on Joe Biden’s supposed indiscretions.

We get into a bit of a political debate, to realize soon enough, thankfully—it’s kinda pointless in these polarized times. Waste of time. Nobody’s winning this.

But she has her firm opinions, and it’s do with the fact that her brother Sandeep (the real ‘Sunny’), a chef, has to be pay for Obamacare (America’s healthcare programme, supported by the Democrats.)

“Well, he can’t feed himself, and it’s okay that he must pay premium for Obamacare? He must have the choice, whether to, or not. America is all about choice.”

Okay, okay, moving on. If you follow her conversations, even casually, the only prism to assess Karenjit, as a person, is to see her quite simply as an astute business person. “And doing business is slightly different in India,” she says.

Something she needs to adjust to: “We are Americans. We do our work, and move on. Over here, more emotions get involved. That’s what businesses run on. That you must meet next week, too, even when the work is over. It was a learning curve. And something that Danny and I have realised we need to pay attention to.”

That said, Sunny sees India as the market to be in: “Even if you go to Bandra, and check with people selling slippers there, how much they make—it’ll shock you. Of course, there is competition, but running small businesses, even mom and pop shops, is much easier, than in America. Just look at the number of people here!”

As a big enough brand herself—with a premium valuation for everything, from ribbon-cutting, to product endorsements—there are businesses she runs, with Sunny Leone as the leverage.

She says, “It helps me live my passion, which was always business, since I was a child. I was that kid knocking on doors, selling you stuff—starting with lemonade, shoveling snow... Even when I entered the  adult industry, I built my own website, learnt HTML, marketing, photoshop for images, video, ran my own affiliate programme…”

Not that we’re taxmen to ask how much she makes—it certainly sounds like an empire of sorts, by Indian standards. What does she do with her money—does she have guilty-pleasure luxuries, say, a private island?

“I hope Danny buys me one in Maldives, where we keep going for holidays. No, I’m just a plough-horse on a farm, that keeps working. I’m lucky, because my husband buys stuff for us. But we spent on our house here [in Andheri West], our cars… We also save money—we have three kids, a lot of it will go to them.”

How about a private jet? “Oh, I would never buy that. Not even reserve a seat in a time-share [programme]!” Why’s that? Well, there is a story.

“Okay, firstly, those private jets are nothing like you see in amazing images, and ads. They’re dinkies. We got into a private plane, going to Latur [in Maharashtra], because there is no commercial airport there. The plane got into a crazy air-pocket. We had the Sardar pilot loudly praying, ‘Waahe Guruji, Waahe Guruji...’ Our security guy’s legs were flying in two different directions, hands elsewhere. Danny was losing it with the manager, who’d booked us in the plane. I was trying to calm him down. I swore, I’ll never fly such a plane again.

“And guess what? A month later, we learnt, that we had matched with a girl [Nisha] for adoption. Guess where? Latur! I asked my manager to book a private charter, again. He said, ‘Are you out of your mind?’ We had to return to Latur, to eventually pick Nisha up, thereafter, as well. I guess, Latur and I are connected, in the most amazing and non-amazing ways! But yes, I don’t mind the last row of a commercial flight—no private jet!”

Done. No private jet for most of us who are reading this either. Just that we will never afford it—at least we can feel better about it! To think of it, everything began for Sunny with photos in girlie magazines, and videos that went viral, before that term was invented.

While production of porn is illegal in India, I tell her about how there is a thriving underground, local, adult films’ scene. One of the male stars of which, an actor called Shakespeare (it’s his real name), I’ve been in touch with, as a journalist, for quite some time.

Shakespeare tells me about how Sunny’s unthinkable commercial success had inspired a cottage eco-system of female aspirants. Which, in a way, also reflects a changing society, when it becomes to matters of shame and guilt, associated with sex.

Is she aware of this, or does she have a take on it? “How would I know [of what’s going on]? I live in my own bubble. When I go out to meet people, it’s not like they say, come on, let’s talk about sex!”

The truth is, those aspirants will not see anything close to Sunny days, ever. Maybe even get penalized/ostracized for it, in the long run, who knows?

Consider Mia Khalifa—an adult film star, about as well-known as Sunny. In 2014, she shot a dozen videos for $12,000, which remained her lifetime’s income from it. Her popularity  subsequently soared, but she gained nothing.

And she never actually wished to be a ‘porn star’, she said—coming out in public, eventually, shining a light on the exploitative nature of America’s adult film industry. To which, Sunny responds, “How do I put this in a nice way? Read your contract!”

She adds, “I worked only with the best people. I have no horror stories. I read through and corrected every single contract, [to ensure] I was gaining something from it. I was in control of everything that I was doing. And I do believe, in that industry, there are different sides. But from my perspective, I was in complete control. I saw it as a means to get towards something different.”

As for whether she empathizes with Mia’s state/claims, at least, she argues, “Let’s say, you are going to broadcast this interview on one platform. But you also license it out to several other outlets. If I sign a contract that says, no, you can’t. Then, you can’t. Sure, you could end up with people who lie. But usually, at least in my experience, people are straightforward.”

In her own case, while she’s exited the adult industry, her videos continue to fly: “Exactly! You can’t get rid of the Internet, it’s impossible. But I did make sure—I got out of whatever time I spent on it. I did.

“Also, you know—it’s like me telling you to limit where you are going to put out this interview. Is that going to help me, or hurt me? Do I want you to exploit this interview? Of course.”

If we go back again to the Karenjit Kaur series, the one who was evidently hurt by Sunny’s choice of profession was her mother, foremost. Apparently, she veered towards alcoholism, as a result?

“No, my mother became an alcoholic, way before my life choices. We went through a lot of craziness in our house, because of this addiction. It was sad, because you always want to think that your mother loves you more than alcohol. But it wasn’t about that. It was an addiction—something psychological that needed to be repaired from the inside. That had nothing to do with me.”

“Was I a trigger? Most definitely. But I was always a trigger. It didn’t matter what I did—whether it was coming home late, or anything she didn’t like. When [the adult industry] happened, it was, you know, a stamp-trigger. It was not fun at all.”

Which brings me to what can only be termed the successful ‘porn star paradox’. And it’s something any libertarian parent might have to deal with. Which is—what if their child tells them they wish to follow in the footsteps of Sunny, given the immeasurable amounts of fame and money she has achieved? What would they even say? How would Sunny respond, if her children asked her the same?

“I would have to educate them as much as possible—to let them know of pros and the cons of this [decision]. They will obviously know [about] what I have done in my life, at some point. They are too young now. I made certain decisions, because of whatever circumstances in my life. So, if I can provide you with sound decisions—where you know what you are doing, and if you are okay with that—then I don’t think I would be able to stop anybody, after a certain age. I don’t know—they are only 5 and 7. It’s a long time from now. My main worry is how to get through their teenage years! I think that will be more difficult than some of the life choices they make after 18.”

Her children’s professional future is way ahead of them, of course—we may still be looking far too much into Sunny’s past as well, while she’s currently at another cusp in her career.

She returned from Cannes, where her film, Kennedy, premièred before a packed house, at the biggest venue of the festival. It’s surprising that this was her first time at the French riviera, given the number of stars, celebrities and wannabes walk the red-carpet there for a photo-op.

She was a rare one from India, with an actual film, to show for it. The screening at the world’s top cinema fete concluded with a reported seven-minute standing ovation. Sunny, you could see, was in tears.

“I was crying like a baby the entire week at Cannes. It was a really emotional trip. And there are two sides of it. One is the film itself, which I am so happy and proud of. Then, there is my personal journey—and what does Cannes means to me, in it? If you told me, when I stepped foot in the Bigg Boss house—that 11 years later, I would be walking the red carpet at the Cannes Film Festival, I would have told you to go, f*** yourself! That you are some crazy man, who took some blue pill. And that’s the crazy journey that I’ve had.”

He forayed into Bollywood as a lyricist in 2003 with Jism. And as the film turns 20 today, Neelesh Misra takes us through the experience of working on the Bipasha Basu and John Abraham-starrer. “Jaadu Hai Nasha Hai was my first song as a lyric writer and it became such a benchmark that everyone wanted me to write songs on similar lines. Since it released at a time when we had just entered the new millennium, it started a new trend of songwriting. Though it was edgy and sensuous, it was beautifully romantic. There was nothing vulgar or obscene about it,” says Misra, as he goes on to explain how it wasn’t easy for him to start out as a lyricist, given the way songs were made back then.

He adds, “It was during my first music sitting in Mumbai when I found out that the tune of a song was created first and the lyricist had to fit the words into it. When I sat down to write Jaadu Hai Nasha Hai, I just couldn’t do it. This was the first time in my life when I failed at something on day one. I felt awful as I couldn’t meet the expectations that Bhatt sahab (filmmaker Mahesh Bhatt; story and screenplay writer of Jism) and Pooja (Bhatt; producer) had on me.”

Interestingly, the song worked out in an unexpected manner and he credits composer M M Kreem for making him feel comfortable: “I was in a cab and suddenly some words crossed my mind. I wrote Jaadu Hai Nasha Hai on the rear side of a food bill and when I shared the lines with Bhatt sahab, he was ecstatic.”

Misra also penned the song Chalo Tumko Lekar Chalein. “I wrote the lyrics of the song in a classic ghazal metre. I feel the way Mr Kreem captured the silence in the song was beautiful,” says the lyricist.

Since Jaadu Hai Nasha Hai had sensuous visuals, it was received well at Misra’s home: “I was very excited about the promo of the song, as it was my first Bollywood track. I come from a middle-class family and I still remember my father said, ‘I will listen to the songs you write, but won’t see them’,” he quips.

Alia Bhatt and Ranbir Kapoor became proud parents to a baby girl on Sunday morning. The couple shared the news on social media, and their family members followed suit. Some family members, including Alia’s mother Soni Razdan and Ranbir’s mother Neetu Kapoor, were seen visiting the couple on Sunday evening. Alia’s half-brother Rahul Bhatt, who has been away for work, hasn’t been able to meet the proud parents and baby yet.

Sharing his excitement, he told BT, “I am overwhelmed. I haven’t been able to see the child, but I am just happy that both the mother and the baby are hale and hearty because that’s very important.”

He further added that his father, Mahesh Bhatt, is extremely excited to meet the little one. Rahul shared, “He’s the proudest person right now. He couldn’t wait for the baby’s arrival. What has happened is that he has had three daughters (Pooja, Shaheen and Alia), so it is a déjà vu of sorts for him. He is comparing this to the time when his first daughter, Pooja, was born.”

Talking about new parents, Alia and Ranbir, Rahul says, “Alia is very responsible, and I think Ranbir will be an extremely hands-on dad.”

Talking to Bombay Times, Ranbir’s sister Riddhima Kapoor Sahni, who was in France, said, “I am ecstatic! The feeling of becoming a bua is just something else, and I can’t wait to see the little one now!” — Renuka Vyavahare

Filmmaker Mahesh Bhatt and his daughter, actor-director Pooja Bhatt launched Samarpan, a centre for alcohol and drug de-addiction near Pune. The guest of honour was Narendra Baldota, CMD of Baldota Group. Psychotherapist Dr Azhar Hakim spoke about the inception of Samarpan, which means surrender and the services the centre offers. Martin Peters talked about setting up a world-class rehab program.

This 28-day program is focused on addiction recovery. The clients staying at the centre recover in a modern setting. Samarpan is built in a colonial style of architecture offering modern amenities. It’s located away from the hustle and bustle of the city.

Mahesh Bhatt said, “Even after reaching the heights of success and fame, I felt a sense of emptiness, and was addicted to alcohol. When my daughter, Shaheen was born, I returned home after drinking. When I took her in my arms, she turned away because I was smelling of alcohol. It’s been 34 years, and I haven’t had a sip of alcohol,” he adds.

Mahesh says that Dr Rahul Bajpai, COO, didn’t invite them because of their celebrity status, but because they recovered from alcoholism.

Pooja says, “Generally people introduce me as an actress, activist or filmmaker. But they should say I recovered from alcohol addiction.” She goes on to say that while she is remembered for her role of an alcoholic’s daughter in the film Daddy (1989), it was a message from her father that changed her life. “He said, ‘If you love me then you should love yourself.’ I became emotional and gave up alcohol that day,” she says.

Samarpan seeks to aid a 360-degree transformation in individuals by helping them overcome mental blocks, providing a support system, imbuing a sense of hope and ensuring they regain their zest for life. To offer the best outcomes, Samarpan has a team of certified psychiatrists, clinical psychologists and counsellors trained in the US, UK and India, as qualified healthcare and wellness experts.

Though Sadak 2, which had released digitally in 2020, had glimpses of Pooja Bhatt from Sadak (1991), R Balki’s film, Chup - Revenge Of The Artist, will mark her return to the big screen. The psychological thriller also features Sunny Deol, Dulquer Salman and Shreya Dhanwanthary. Last year, Pooja came into the spotlight for her performance in her digital show, Bombay Begums, and she is now keen to play strong, pivotal parts in her future projects.

The actress, who assisted her father, filmmaker Mahesh Bhatt, on Sadak 2, says that she had no plans to return to acting back then. However, her role in the digital show has enthused her to face the camera once again. “I feel privileged that I could play my age on screen in this youth-obsessed world and industry. Otherwise, who gets to play such strong characters at 49? I must say, times are changing,” says Pooja, adding, “I feel this is the best time for actors of all shapes, sizes, ages and backgrounds. Today, there are far more opportunities than in the ’90s when a hero and a heroine had to look and be a certain way. Conventional Bollywood was obsessed with youth, but OTT has wiped that out. With the digital medium, there’s a new language we speak, and Bollywood needs to catch up with it.”

Talking about how she wants her second innings as an actor to shape up, she shares, “Bombay Begums was a perfect fit for me. After that, I wasn’t really looking desperately for new projects. Then this new film just came my way. I am not here to hope, plot and plan. I am here to respond to what comes my way. I am just looking to have unique experiences here. I want to learn new things, improve, grow and push my limits. I am not looking to be in a comfort zone. I am glad that in a short span, I got to do a web show and the film.”

Excited to team up with Balki, Pooja says, “He’s a fantastic director. I liked his film Cheeni Kum. One knows of Balki and the kind of work he has created in the world of advertising. He is known for his details and aesthetics, and he has a different kind of gaze. So, when this project came to me, saying yes was a no brainer.”

Remind Pooja that she has returned to the industry at a time when her sister Alia is among the top actresses, and she says, “Well, this will require a whole different discussion because I can’t sum up Alia Bhatt’s career in two sentences. I have to be fair to my younger sister, who is the better version of me. I can’t speak about her work in films in a few lines.”

Pooja Bhatt recently took to social media, requesting the Government of India for an amendment to the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (PCA) Act of 1960. Under the Act, the highest fine for a first-time offender is limited to ₹50. “A ₹50 fine will never act as a deterrent against animal cruelty,” she asserts. So, the actor-filmmaker, like other animal rights activists, joined the #NoMore50 bandwagon on Twitter to urge the Parliament to take it up in the monsoon session.

According to the Bombay Begums actor, anyone who commits cruelty to animals can harm human life too. She says, “We need to ensure that perpetrators are held accountable, analysed psychologically and given exemplary punishment if we want a more humane society.” Perturbed by how the 1960 Act doesn’t ensure this, Bhatt explains, “When an animal has been abused, tortured or killed, the police, at most, register an FIR under Section 428 IPC and 11(1)(a) PCA Act, 1960... Abusers get bail instantly, unless stringent sections, in cases where firearms or swords are used, are not added.”

She urges that society must act to safeguard the weak. “Since the pandemic, incidents of violence against not only animals, but even against women and kids, have surged. If we want to call ourselves a civilised society, we must ensure the most vulnerable are protected,” she signs off.